ROWETT OUT

Kryan Bing said:
Too many of our players get unwarrented, over the top abuse. Especially on MO...As for GR's abuse yesterday, I find it absolutely staggering after just three games (well, four years really after his service to the club).

Some people on MO have very, very short memories. It was only a matter of weeks ago that Rowett conducted himself in an outstanding and very honorable way during the period after JB's death. That all seems to have gone out the window. That alone should have cut him some slack.
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100%
 
Hopefully the post mortem about yesterday won't go on until Saturdays kick off.
I imagine GR will be tearing the boys a new arsehole today, and probably rightly so, but we must have faith.
New day, a big game on Saturday, let's get behind the whole lot of them and give them a morale boost. Have a moan to your mates, your missus, your dog, and let the team get on with it.
Those who have personally insulted GR would do well to remember we're a well run, competitive club. COYL.
 
I spoke to Gary last night. He isn't going to leave as he said it is not in his DNA.

I do feel for him he has overachieved on a very small budget compared to the majority in this league.

He can give all the instructions and set the team up but it comes down to the 11 that are out their playing. I think a lot of them are getting away with murder from us lot.

I do feel another poor result/performance on Saturday then it will turn very toxic at the den.
 
Wippa said:
The signing of Shark Itch screamed panic buy. The shit Long was getting had clearly filtered through to the club.
he was no where near the worse keeper we’ve had as some people were suggesting. Up until the last half a dozen games of the season he’d had a decent season.
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Also I think the criticism was aimed at his timing to get down to long shots. Something that is difficult to assess unless you are behind the shot. Nobody could properly tell what his visibility was of the incoming missile. Split second and it’s past you.
 
Peckham Lion said:
You're one of the the worst on here for expecting us to win and one of the first to just fall short of a full on enquirey after a defeat.
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Find me one of my posts where I have said, “Oh, we’ll win this game, no trouble!” I’m usually the opposite. Go back on match threads and see where I’m saying things like, “I’d be happy with a draw,” or “I can’t see a win here,” and you’ll find plenty! Why? Because there are just some games where you just know it’s extremely unlikely you’ll get some sort of positive result (even if that means getting a draw!) I never expected us to beat Norwich yesterday, but I was expecting a better reaction after the City defeat! What we got was a lot worse!

Peckham Lion said:
You demand to know why you think the players aren't trying. Expect better results because we played well last season and had a healthy finish. Pull apart Rowetts every decision when we lose.
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What? And I’m the only one on here that does that, am I?

These blokes are meant to be professional footballers and are paid good money to kick a ball about, but can’t string two passes together and you expect supporters to just shut up and say nothing? Same with Rowett’s decision making! Why is it so many of us can see where he’s going wrong, yet you seem to think that no one other than him can be right?

Peckham Lion said:
Sometimes teams are just better than us, simple but noe. There must be some other reason and no stone gets left unturned.
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Yes, some teams are better than us, and most on here (including myself) can handle a defeat as long as the players give us their all. We didn’t get that against City or against Norwich! If we lose to an OG or a wicked deflection, that can’t be helped, but when defending is non existent and players switch off (like they did yesterday), it’s inexcusable when you have seasoned veterans like Cooper and Hutch who are not wet behind the ear novices and should be able to read the game much better than they do!

Peckham Lion said:
Often one nutty theory after another. Quoting what fans of his former clubs think of him. I have news for you- must fans of clubs think there managers are shit and under performing unless they're in the top two. It's fucking ridiculous and just over emotional people being unreasonable and impatient arseholes.
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Why do we say, when we’re looking for a new manager (as some on here said yesterday when mentioning Wilder and Smith), “Nah, we don’t want them, they were defenders, and Wilder could have got Boro relegated had he stayed!” We say it because previous reputations of managers (good or bad) influence how we think and of the three clubs Rowett managed before coming to us, it was only at Birmingham where the supporters didn’t want him gone!

Speak to any Derby or Stoke supporter and see what they have to say about Rowett’s tenure at both clubs, and they will say it was dull, defensive football, and in Stoke’s case Rowett spent upwards of £50M on players, and when he left, Stoke were no better off player performance wise, but that spending crippled them to the point where it affected the club’s financies, and I think it’s only been recently that they’ve had some money to spend on new players! Yes, you could say the Stoke board were wrong to give Rowett that much money, but I don’t think the Stoke supporters would have minded had the players Rowett bought had made a difference to their team! Unfortunately for them, they didn’t!

How many players has Rowett bought into Millwall that you can say, hand on heart, have made a big positive difference to the team? I would say just one: Flemming, and that has been based on his last season’s form! It’s early days for the likes of Nisbet, Bryan, De Norre etc. to show if they are really going to make a difference. Look at some of the dross he’s bought in midfield over the past few seasons: Woods, Kieftenbeld, Bennett, Evans etc. No one had a good word to say about Woods and Evans (Evans is lucky these days to get just a few minutes on the pitch), and whilst Kieftenbeld started off okay, he soon got injured and was in and out of the team! Bennett was the best of the bunch because he was always a trier and scored goals for us, but his injury record let him down and even you were saying at one point we should bin him off, which Rowett eventually did!

Peckham Lion said:
Our gates and spending power are small in comparrison to most in this division. For what we spend and get through the gates has us earmarked for a bottom ten finish. Rowett has got us 11th, 9th and 8th last season. Finishing positions that teams who spent five times more than us couldn't achieve.
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Its not what you do with your spending power that defines you as a club. I’ve supported Wall for 49 years, and in all that time (up to a few years ago), we never had a pot to piss in, but we were still able as a club to have some great (and not so great) managers who bought in or brought through the Academy, talented young (and not so young) players who could play a certain standard of good football which we all enjoyed! Again, hand on heart, can you honestly say that Rowett has assembled a squad that is in any way as good as the squads assembled by George Graham, John Docherty, Bruce Rioch, Mick McCarthy (initially), Mark McGhee, Dennis Wise, Kenny Jackett and Neil Harris?

Peckham Lion said:
We;ve been on a bad run and the daggers are being sharpened. We could change manager tomorrow and still be no better off. We have fans saying we have the best team in years, a team with a defence that can't pass to feet and a midfield that creates fuck all. Fans that ruin there own players and boo them off at half time if we're not winning.
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Its not about being on a bad run (certainly if you’re only thinking of this season so far), but more to do with the fact that Rowett has once again been given money to strengthen the squad, to plug the gaps that were missing at left back and up front, and yet the standard of footballing has got worse!

We all know it’s wrong and pointless to boo the players, and there is no defence when you hear someone call Rowett a “cunt,” but you’re dealing with passionate (though sometimes misguided) supporters, some of whom follow their team home and away, spending thousands over the course of a season, and all they ask in return is a little bit of effort and hopefully see a little bit of good football from the team! Is that really too much to ask?

Peckham Lion said:
I think a bit of realism and patience is required other wise you'll be bound for disappointment. Perhaps a season or two back in our usual hunting ground is what's needed and deserved given some of the attitudes and defeatism on display.
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I think the last 10 games of last season, and the last 3 results of this one, has brought a lot of realism to a lot of supporters who genuinely feel we could be in a relegation battle this season, if things somehow don’t improve! You may think that’s being melodramatic, but you yourself have said before that we’re only one season away from relegation - so why couldn’t it be this season?

Unfortunately, you’re not going to get patience from a lot of supporters who want some sort of action, whether that be player changes, formation and tactics change or a manager change! Supporters live in the here and now, and aren’t thinking that far ahead, except for the Stoke game at home this Saturday! That’s the one where they want to see positive steps being taken! Worrying about how we’re going to play against Southampton at home in early November, can wait awhile!
 
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Life with the Lions said:
Find me one of my posts where I have said, “Oh, we’ll win this game, no trouble!” I’m usually the opposite. Go back on match threads and see where I’m saying things like, “I’d be happy with a draw,” or “I can’t see a win here,” and you’ll find plenty! Why? Because there are just some games where you just know it’s extremely unlikely you’ll get some sort of positive result (even if that means getting a draw!) I never expected us to beat Norwich yesterday, but I was expecting a better reaction after the City defeat! What we got was a lot worse!



What? And I’m the only one on here that does that, am I?

These blokes are meant to be professional footballers and are paid good money to kick a ball about, but can’t string two passes together and you expect supporters to just shut up and say nothing? Same with Rowett’s decision making! Why is it so many of us can see where he’s going wrong, yet you seem to think that no one other than him can be right?



Yes, some teams are better than us, and most on here (including myself) can handle a defeat as long as the players give us their all. We didn’t get that against City or against Norwich! If we lose to an OG or a wicked deflection, that can’t be helped, but when defending is non existent and players switch off (like they did yesterday), it’s inexcusable when you have seasoned veterans like Cooper and Hutch who are not wet behind the ear novices and should be able to read the game much better than they do!



Why do we say, when we’re looking for a new manager (as some on here said yesterday when mentioning Wilder and Smith), “Nah, we don’t want them, they were defenders, and Wilder could have got Boro relegated had he stayed!” We say it because previous reputations of managers (good or bad) influence how we think and of the three clubs Rowett managed before coming to us, it was only at Birmingham where the supporters didn’t want him gone!

Speak to any Derby or Stoke supporter and see what they have to say about Rowett’s tenure at both clubs, and they will say it was dull, defensive football, and in Stoke’s case Rowett spent upwards of £50M on players, and when he left, Stoke were no better off player performance wise, but that spending crippled them to the point where it affected the club’s financies, and I think it’s only been recently that they’ve had some money to spend on new players! Yes, you could say the Stoke board were wrong to give Rowett that much money, but I don’t think the Stoke supporters would have minded had the players Rowett bought had made a difference to their team! Unfortunately for them, they didn’t!

How many players has Rowett bought into Millwall that you can say, hand on heart, have made a big positive difference to the team? I would say just one: Flemming, and that has been based on his last season’s form! It’s early days for the likes of Nisbet, Bryan, De Norre etc. to show if they are really going to make a difference. Look at some of the dross he’s bought in midfield over the past few seasons: Woods, Kieftenbeld, Bennett, Evans etc. No one had a good word to say about Woods and Evans (Evans is lucky these days to get just a few minutes on the pitch), and whilst Kieftenbeld started off okay, he soon got injured and was in and out of the team! Bennett was the best of the bunch because he was always a trier and scored goals for us, but his injury record let him down and even you were saying at one point we should bin him off, which Rowett eventually did!



Its not what you do with your spending power that defines you as a club. I’ve supported Wall for 49 years, and in all that time (up to a few years ago), we never had a pot to piss in, but we were still able as a club to have some great (and not so great) managers who bought in or brought through the Academy, talented young (and not so young) players who could play a certain standard of good football which we all enjoyed! Again, hand on heart, can you honestly say that Rowett has assembled a squad that is in any way as good as the squads assembled by George Graham, John Docherty, Bruce Rioch, Mick McCarthy (initially), Mark McGhee, Dennis Wise, Kenny Jackett and Neil Harris?



Its not about being on a bad run (certainly if you’re only thinking of this season so far), but more to do with the fact that Rowett has once again been given money to strengthen the squad, to plug the gaps that were missing at left back and up front, and yet the standard of footballing has got worse!

We all know it’s wrong and pointless to boo the players, and there is no defence when you hear someone call Rowett a “cunt,” but you’re dealing with passionate (though sometimes misguided) supporters, some of whom follow their team home and away, spending thousands over the course of a season, and all they ask in return is a little bit of effort and hopefully see a little bit of good football from the team! Is that really too much to ask?



I think the last 10 games of last season, and the last 3 results of this one, has brought a lot of realism to a lot of supporters who genuinely feel we could be in a relegation battle this season, if things somehow don’t improve! You may think that’s being melodramatic, but you yourself have said before that we’re only one season away from relegation - so why couldn’t it be this season?

Unfortunately, you’re not going to get patience from a lot of supporters who want some sort of action, whether that be player changes, formation and tactics change or a manager change! Supporters live in the here and now, and aren’t thinking that far ahead, except for the Stoke game at home this Saturday! That’s the one where they want to see positive steps being taken! Worrying about how we’re going to play against Southampton at home in early November, can wait awhile!
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Fucking hell mate, I'd need to have a day off to read that lot
 
Managerial changes this early in the season smacks of panic and desperation and I don't see Kavanagh and James Berylson doing that. I can only see a change happening if we lose the next five games and I'm very confident that is not going to happen.

I know I said it before on this thread but who could come in and do a better job? There are countless example of managers being hired and fired and the majority of them don't work. You may get an initial bounce but the fundamental problems remain the same no matter who the manager is. Look at Chelsea. Look at Everton. Tottenham. Watford. Leeds.
 
Seriously, supporters are berating the manager after only 4 games!? That's embarrassing, they sound more like palace fans who feel they 'deserve' to be flying higher than anyone else. Don't get me wrong, if we are relegation fodder by Christmas I'm sure the board will discuss what needs to be done... by getting behind the team will give them encouragement and more likely to start winning some games.... the trouble with some people these days, they want a quick fix for everything. Hopefully Rowett will decide to try a more attacking formation rather than being overly defensive and things will turn around.
 
Millwalljohn said:
Seriously, supporters are berating the manager after only 4 games!? That's embarrassing, they sound more like palace fans who feel they 'deserve' to be flying higher than anyone else. Don't get me wrong, if we are relegation fodder by Christmas I'm sure the board will discuss what needs to be done... by getting behind the team will give them encouragement and more likely to start winning some games.... the trouble with some people these days, they want a quick fix for everything. Hopefully Rowett will decide to try a more attacking formation rather than being overly defensive and things will turn around.
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Excellent post mate.
 
Ilderton Wanderer said:
I know that mate, I’m talking more about the the Facebook/Twitter side of things where certain players have been getting stick for months now yet these people somehow can’t see how that kind of personal abuse might affect an individual.

I actually saw fans bragging last week about Long and Burey being hounded out and justifying it by giving the ‘we are Millwall and if you can’t handle it tough shit’ line. This weird obsession with players and managers ‘getting us’ is stopping us from kicking on and right now is bordering on narcissism in my opinion.

And yes you are spot on, George Long was absolutely nowhere near as bad as those were making out, in fact I don’t recall him making a rickett as bad as Sarckic did yesterday for Norwich’s second goal.
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Sunderland at home last year crashed out and completely missed the ball. In fact he was a dreadful keeper who cost us well over 10 goals last year. And I’d back that up watching the highlights after my impressions at the game. Millwall did the right thing outing him and bringing in a new keeper who I think will be good-if he’s given a bloody chance. In fact Sarkic would have got that ball it just deflected off someone’s head just as he was going to get it. Long was a very poor keeper in every sense, getting down, positioning etc Because we’ve made a poor start, he hadn’t suddenly become good!!! This post refects my opinion of course.
 
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robbo555 said:
Managerial changes this early in the season smacks of panic and desperation and I don't see Kavanagh and James Berylson doing that. I can only see a change happening if we lose the next five games and I'm very confident that is not going to happen.

I know I said it before on this thread but who could come in and do a better job? There are countless example of managers being hired and fired and the majority of them don't work. You may get an initial bounce but the fundamental problems remain the same no matter who the manager is. Look at Chelsea. Look at Everton. Tottenham. Watford. Leeds.
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Robbo, I think a lot of Wall supporters right now just want to see good, attacking, cohesive football! If Rowett were to change his footballing philosophy, starting at home against Stoke this Saturday, and results and performances improved, then I think most supporters would be happy for Rowett to stay! Unfortunately, we all know that he isn’t capable of changing his philosophy unless he’s forced to (as he had to do last season), but it never seems to last and he’s already reverted back to his old ways this season!

I would have said before yesterday that I didn’t think any Wall supporter actually hated the man personally (I know I don’t), and even though yesterday’s use of the “cunt” word was bang out of order, it’s very telling that supporters have used that word to relay to Rowett how negative, defensive and cautious his football has been over these last few seasons! They’ve had enough and they want change! Whether James Berylson will give them that, remains to be seen!

Football is first and foremost about winning, but it’s also about entertaining your supporters home and away! We’ve had brief glimpses of that under Rowett, though not enough! Would a new manager give us a better, winning team long term? Possibly. It would all depend on who’s available and how they can utilise Rowett’s players into a new formidable force, or whether new additions were needed to replace those that the new manager doesn’t think is up to snuff!

Let’s face it, the Championship over the past 2 or 3 years hasn’t been great, which is probably why we have done much better than we would have normally, but I think this season is going to be different and harder! Unless Rowett and the players adapt to old/new teams different formations and tactics, it’s going to be a long old slog for both the players and the supporters alike!
 
Presented without comment.

Rowett's finishing positions in the league for all teams he has managed.

2012/13 Burton Albion League Two 4th (lost in play-off semi-final)
2013/14 Burton Albion League Two 6th (lost in play-off final)
2014/15 Birmingham City Championship 10th (took over when they were 23rd)
2015/16 Birmingham City Championship 10th
2016/17 Birmingham City Championship 7th (sacked December 2016 and team finished 19th)
2016/17 Derby County Championship 9th (took over in March 2017)
2017/18 Derby County Championship 6th (lost in play-off semi-final)
2018/19 Stoke City Championship 14th (sacked in January 2019 and team finished 16th)
2019/20 Millwall Championship 8th (took over when they were 18th)
2020/21 Millwall Championship 11th
2021/22 Millwall Championship 9th
2022/23 Millwall Championship 8th
 
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