ROWETT OUT

[norwichmark]

It's not the results that bother me so much, it's the fact that he's football has been boring as fuck since he took over, bar the first 4 or 5 months! Why the fuck would you want to pay hard earned money week after week to go and watch a team set up defensively when we have the best attacking players we have had in years!!!
So you say look at the league position... I generally would prefer to see us play some fucking football for once and actually go for the win and finish fifth from bottom rather then suffer that shit all season. Millwall have never been a sit back and just take it kind of team but of late it seems like alot of people are happy with that aslong as we finish 8-12.
No fuck that, football is supposed to be entertaining, its supposed to be exciting! wake up and smell the coffee, he is not taking us any further. I most certainly ain't paying to watch that shit week in and week out like I did for most of last year. He's got to go, it needs freshening up.

Lot of good stuff

 

[Stowwall]

Not sure if Fleming is not fit or not but he seemed to want a drink quite often yesterday and seem to have quite a few energy gels

A week or so ago Rowett said that Flemming had a difficult pre season, so maybe like a few of them, ain't up to speed yet. that situation changes pdq starting at the 6 fingered ones would be a bonus. Think we have the squad and players now to bin this 5 at the back bollocks. I personally would play it home and away despite the superb performance at Boro. Get the players consistently playing a 442 which I think would suit the players/squad we've got.
Just my opinion.
Only 2 games in, spat me dummy myself a bit y'day, mainly cos of this shit back 5 tactic, we will improve.

 

[Poplar Lion]

I agree with Ackers87 too.
It's not really about the results, it's performances, especially at home.

If the result at Boro was a draw last week I would have been happy with that. It was good game even as a 0-0. We had a go, they had a go. No problem. The win in the end was a bonus.

Yesterday, I would have made the changes at half time. We created absolutely nothing first half so try something different. There was nothing to get the crowd going at all. Then we get to 60 minutes and still nothing and still no changes. Then you're asking our two youngest, inexperience players to come on and change the game in 10 minutes.
I really thought that we had got past all this last season with the switch back to a 4 when the 5 didn't work. Yes, we came up a bit short in the end but no problem with that as we gave it a go in most games. Now, we revert to type and try to go all defensive again, sitting on the edge of our own box and hoping to sneak the odd goal from a corner.

 

[Lionsteele]

I agree with Ackers87 too.
It's not really about the results, it's performances, especially at home.

If the result at Boro was a draw last week I would have been happy with that. It was good game even as a 0-0. We had a go, they had a go. No problem. The win in the end was a bonus.

Yesterday, I would have made the changes at half time. We created absolutely nothing first half so try something different. There was nothing to get the crowd going at all. Then we get to 60 minutes and still nothing and still no changes. Then you're asking our two youngest, inexperience players to come on and change the game in 10 minutes.
I really thought that we had got past all this last season with the switch back to a 4 when the 5 didn't work. Yes, we came up a bit short in the end but no problem with that as we gave it a go in most games. Now, we revert to type and try to go all defensive again, sitting on the edge of our own box and hoping to sneak the odd goal from a corner.

Exactly my thoughts mate. Some people will die on the Rowett hill what ever he does. As much as I think he’s done a great job with what he has & I don’t want him out. it’s clear he doesn’t seem know how to set up positively enough at home or when to make the correct subs to come away from plan A.

I can suffer away from home, but not infront of a packed Den. Has a massive effect on the atmosphere when you start defensively.

 

[Brusselslion]

To misquote Harold Wilson: "A week's a long time in football".

After the Boro match, the general consensus was that Rowett was a master tactician, we had the best squad since the late '80s and we were certs for promotion: A week later, Rowett needs to go, most of the squad are shit and we are going down.

For what it's worth, my view is that Rowett is a decent manager but errs on the side of caution too often. As for the team: Sarkic - difficult to tell. Not had a meaningful shot to save. No chance with the goal on Saturday. Distribution ok but not great; WBs - decent enough defensively. Both take up good positions going forward but end-product lacking. CBs - solid enough defensively but poor bringing the ball out. We need a Ballard/ Cresswell loaner who is comfortable on the ball as well as being a competent defender. CMs - De Norre looks good. Billy has been ok but I'd prefer Saville. Would also add balance as Sav is left-footed. Playmaker - I think Fleming has linked up play well at times, however, like last season he does not impose himself and drifts in and out of games. If we can get £10m for him, I'd sell. The alternative is Esse. Certainly seems to have great talent. Could he impose himself on a game for 90 mins? Guess we won't know until it's tried. Forward - Both Watmore and Emarku have done well. I'd start Watmore and replace him on the hour; CF - Not much to choose between Nisbitt and Bradshaw from what I've seen so far. Decent enough without being outstanding.

I'm off to find cover now.

 

[coldblower]

We have lost 6 of last 9 at home.
Rowett needs to change this quickly or more people will be on his case.

 

[BigPaul]

Yesterday, I would have made the changes at half time.

100% this.
It does not make sense to wait when we were clearly being out thought and out played for almost the entire first half?
What was going to change and how?
Making a change was the only possible answer.


And I did say so at the time.

 

[Kryan Bing]

I'm off to find cover now.

No need to find cover, I thinks a pretty decent opinion.

 

[norwichmark]

To misquote Harold Wilson: "A week's a long time in football".

After the Boro match, the general consensus was that Rowett was a master tactician, we had the best squad since the late '80s and we were certs for promotion: A week later, Rowett needs to go, most of the squad are shit and we are going down.

For what it's worth, my view is that Rowett is a decent manager but errs on the side of caution too often. As for the team: Sarkic - difficult to tell. Not had a meaningful shot to save. No chance with the goal on Saturday. Distribution ok but not great; WBs - decent enough defensively. Both take up good positions going forward but end-product lacking. CBs - solid enough defensively but poor bringing the ball out. We need a Ballard/ Cresswell loaner who is comfortable on the ball as well as being a competent defender. CMs - De Norre looks good. Billy has been ok but I'd prefer Saville. Would also add balance as Sav is left-footed. Playmaker - I think Fleming has linked up play well at times, however, like last season he does not impose himself and drifts in and out of games. If we can get £10m for him, I'd sell. The alternative is Esse. Certainly seems to have great talent. Could he impose himself on a game for 90 mins? Guess we won't know until it's tried. Forward - Both Watmore and Emarku have done well. I'd start Watmore and replace him on the hour; CF - Not much to choose between Nisbitt and Bradshaw from what I've seen so far. Decent enough without being outstanding.

I'm off to find cover now.

I’d go 4-5-1 Saturday against naaaaarich. We will need to be careful or it could be very embarrassing. They are quick full of movement and have a player who can be very unplayable. (Sara). Danny Hutch Wallace Bryan.
Emakhu Sav Denorre billy whatmore
Nisbet. Sarkic in goal. We all have our opinions. I feel Nisbet is all round a better footballer than Tom. And Murray gives me more confidence than Cooper especially with receiving a ball and passing it. If it wasn’t Norwich I’d stick Harding next to Wallace. Let’s hope our psychology works Sunday, no chance of winning but pull it off.

 

[Phlion54]

Just read GR latest comments on the game and said he could not put his finger on the problem and take the Reading game out of the picture , it was the same back 4/5 in both games and the same negative tactics/ formation, says Flemming as had troubled start I would say he has been anonymous & frankly shite in every game so far and needs to be dropped and give a player who will give us 100% on the pitch, played the ball on the floor at Boro and looked decent but at home reverted to the long hapless hoofs as our back 4/5 cannot pass a ball with any quality on our pitch....Will be interesting to see what he says after today's team meeting and even more on the team for sunday

 

[Gaeilge Millwall]

1 point outside the playoffs....... just saying

 

[Stowwall]

To misquote Harold Wilson: "A week's a long time in football".

After the Boro match, the general consensus was that Rowett was a master tactician, we had the best squad since the late '80s and we were certs for promotion: A week later, Rowett needs to go, most of the squad are shit and we are going down.

For what it's worth, my view is that Rowett is a decent manager but errs on the side of caution too often. As for the team: Sarkic - difficult to tell. Not had a meaningful shot to save. No chance with the goal on Saturday. Distribution ok but not great; WBs - decent enough defensively. Both take up good positions going forward but end-product lacking. CBs - solid enough defensively but poor bringing the ball out. We need a Ballard/ Cresswell loaner who is comfortable on the ball as well as being a competent defender. CMs - De Norre looks good. Billy has been ok but I'd prefer Saville. Would also add balance as Sav is left-footed. Playmaker - I think Fleming has linked up play well at times, however, like last season he does not impose himself and drifts in and out of games. If we can get £10m for him, I'd sell. The alternative is Esse. Certainly seems to have great talent. Could he impose himself on a game for 90 mins? Guess we won't know until it's tried. Forward - Both Watmore and Emarku have done well. I'd start Watmore and replace him on the hour; CF - Not much to choose between Nisbitt and Bradshaw from what I've seen so far. Decent enough without being outstanding.

I'm off to find cover now.

No need to find cover, far too sensible in my eyes.
You sure you're Wall.
Bin the 5 and I think we'll be good. But there's the problem, how long before he does it, if ever.

 

[Kryan Bing]

No need to find cover, far too sensible in my eyes.
You sure you're Wall.
Bin the 5 and I think we'll be good. But there's the problem, how long before he does it, if ever.

I don't think it will be too soon. He will want to make it look like it was his idea and not forced on him by most of the bellowing & baying Kitchener mob sitting behind him...

 

[Lionsteele]

I don't think it will be too soon. He will want to make it look like it was his idea and not forced on him by most of the bellowing & baying Kitchener mob sitting behind him...

This is exactly what happened last year

 

[Kryan Bing]

This is exactly what happened last year

 

[Life with the Lions]

I think we're at the stage where some fans want to see push on from where are. When we come from the division below fans just want us to reatain our league status and have a good cup run. This is our seventh season in the championship since we were last promoted. Only bettered by a nine season run in the old second division from 66 to 75.

Survival in the Championship has to be, first and foremost, the priority. If we’re already losing £12M every season in the Championship, it will be a helluva lot worse if we get relegated! Playing in league 1 means our gates will be lower, we’ll have less money to attract and buy better quality players, sponsorship money will be reduced as will the money from Sly! Anything other than avoiding relegation has to be a bonus!

But what happens next? What is expected? To push on again and try to come ahead of teams with much bigger spending power?

I think, for a lot of supporters, there is a need to push on from last season, partly because we got so close to the play offs, and partly because a club like Luton, who were probably working from a similar wage bill and operating costs as we were last season (and who, ten years ago were playing in the conference), managed to achieve the impossible and get promoted to the Premier League!

When supporters see things in those terms, it’s only human nature to want the same for your own club, and that’s where I think a lot of supporters frustration comes from: we end up taking a step forward in terms of money made available for better recruitment, only to take two steps back when, for whatever reason (players, manager, bad luck), things go tits up just when we don’t want them to!

Teams that are dropping out of the premier league with £90 million in there back pocket which is spread out to £30 million per season for the next three seasons. They may also be coming back down with a huge slice of wedge earnt while in the premier. Clubs that recieve these parchute payments are 3 times more likely to be promoted than other teams in the league.we're up aginst it every which way we turn..

If a club like ours wants promotion, we’re gonna have to stick to the Brentford plan which is to buy younger talent from the lower leagues and abroad, sell them on in the future for massive profit, and use that profit to slowly build a squad of players that, over time, will eventually get the club promoted! We’ve got our foot on the first rung of the ladder in that regard, but how long it takes to get to the top of it is anyone’s guess! What we don’t want is to get almost to the top, then slip at the last moment and fall flat on our arse!

How do we compete against that? A small club with annual turnover of around £18 million. At the same time we posted a pre tax loss of just over £12 million. Those losses are quite low compared to other clubs in the division but are losses all the same. Those other clubs can and are paying three times the wages that we can. We are one of the lowest cash generators in the division.

Maybe the way to get round that is that once promoted, any new or existing players would have to sign a new contract which would have a clause in it that states that if relegation happens in any year of their tenure with us, their salaries would have to be readjusted downwards, to reflect the loss of club earnings whilst being back in the Championship! I’m sure other promoted Championship clubs have done that in the past, and we shouldn’t be any different to them!

We have lost money every season for the past 12 years. The last time we posted a pre tax profit was in 2002. Being in the championship puts a club like us under certain pressures because whilst turnover will rise at the same time so will our wage bill. and running costs.

Agreed, and if we did get to the Prem then maybe the way to limit that financial pressure would be to not throw millions around trying to attract top, top talent (as Forest did when they went up, to the tune of £100M+), but rather continue as we were doing in the Championship by attracting the type of tier 2 level players like Flemming and Caspar! Those types of players will still come to us in the Prem and no doubt be much happier on lower, but better salaries than they had before! It also puts them in the shop window so if they do well with us, they might eventually snag a move to a bigger Prem club, and enjoy even further riches and success!

That way, if we were unfortunate to be relegated in our first season, we wouldn’t be shelling out mega bucks to our contracted players on a reduced Championship budget! We would also have two years of parachute money coming to us to ease any financial issues we may still have, and if need be we could use some of that money to strengthen the squad to attempt a return to the Prem at the first time of asking!

Even if we kept yo-yoing between the Championship and the Prem for a few years, I think eventually the breakthrough would come, and we’d survive that first season, then survive the 2nd, then the 3rd, and hopefully cement our place in the Prem, just as clubs like Wolves and Palace have done!

OK, this all sounds great reading it on the forum, and I may be way off the mark with what I think can be done and achieved, but if James Berylson is half as good as his dad was, hopefully he’ll steer us in the right direction with a similar plan to my one, and with good housekeeping and a cool head, eventually get us there!

 

[Life with the Lions]

With all that in mind where do go next? Fans opinions and hopes will be divided and differing. I reckon age will also play a big factor in peoples opinions. I'd imagine fans under the age of 30 would be very keen on making the premier league whilst fans over 40 will be more split and may even see it as being not so important. In the end it all comes down to personal preferance and expectations.

As unpalatable as it is, the only way for clubs like ours to survive, prosper and do well in this age of billionaire football owners, millionaire players, managers and agents is to be in the tent pissing out, rather than being outside, pissing in! No one on here likes Sky or what they’ve done by creating this awful Premier League, but unfortunately if a club is to be measured as a profitable success, both on and off the pitch, the Prem is the place to be to achieve that!

I ask because maybe already have but if we haven't will sooner or later reach our ceiling. If there isn't going to be another floor that's reachable above what do we do. want or expect to happen?

As I said above, if our new chairman goes about this the right way, and we don’t go all Bertie Big Bollocks to achieve success, I think we can get to the next floor (promotion), but there just has to be a proper, well thought out plan that everyone at the club can work to! Remember: if you build it, they will come!

Will fans be happy with being a competitive championship team that can sit comfortably in the middle and with very little chance of going up or down. Just floating about comfortably being an established championship team. Or will they demand more and won't rest until perhaps one day we do by chance reach the fucking promised land ? I fucking hate that saying and terminology.

I think most Wall supporters (and many on here) would be happy to stay in the Championship, but from a business point of view (and you mentioned it in your post), it isn’t financially achievable. The longer we stay in the Championship, and keep shelling out a million pounds here, and a million pounds there every season or so (on players we hope will get us promoted), then there may come a time where our new chairman may think that running a loss making football club is no longer a viable option!

As much as we hope so, we don’t really know if James Berylson‘s love affair with Millwall will be as strong as it was with his dad, and for all we know, he could end up being a totally ruthless enough businessman, prepared to cut ties with the club if things aren’t working out for his company somewhere down the line!

Of course that’s a worse case scenario option, but until we know James’ intent for our club going forward, nothing can be taken off the table! What stage are we at with this regen project? Is it still going ahead? Has work on it already begun? I don’t know, but does anyone else know? If nothing’s happened yet (or the project is on the back burner for whatever reason), is that going to affect James’ continued financial support and backing?

Yes, I hear you all cry, it’s all ‘if‘s, but’s and maybe’s,’ but any uncertainty can affect both the players and us, the supporters! None of us want James Berylson and his company to sell our club to new owners, now or in the future, because they could turn out to be potential shysters who don’t give a fuck about us, or our club, and are only in it to extract as much money as they can from it, then attempt to flip it to make some kind of monetary profit! We laughed at the spotters predicament these past 10 years with their dodgy owners, but deep down it would be catastrophic for the club if that scenario happened to us!

I do think some fans expectations are quite unrealistic when you take into account what i've laid out above. But not completely unrealistic if everything clicks at the right time and lady luck shines down on us.

This. It happened in the 1987/1988 season, so why shouldn’t lightning strike twice for us?

It' also very understandable that fans want to go up to a higher division otherwise what's the point they'll argue. I'm at the point in my time following us ( 46th season now) that i'm content that we are a very stable and well run club when you take into consideration that for many of our years in existence we spent plenty of time much lower down the ladder and have even faced extinction.

Agreed. Rowett’s mantra to the players should be, ”a man’s reach should exceed his grasp!” otherwise, as you said, what’s the point?

I'm am mindful that reaching the premier league could also eventually end in tears as it has for clubs like Pompey, Swindon, Bradford and one of the premier leagues founding members in in1993, Oldham. A club now that exist outside the football league in the conferance.

The chairman and the board have to learn from the mistakes of other clubs! We had two wonderful (well, one really), seasons in the old First Division, and though the players worked their bollocks off to get us back up in that 1990/1991 season, it wasn’t to be! Yet, we’re still here and are in a much better position, stadium wise and monetary wise than we’ve ever been in our club’s history! There’s no reason why we can’t try for promotion again, as long as we cut our cloth accordingly and take our time to make sure we have all our ducks lined up in a neat row!

Baring in mind we have good and trustworthy owners i don't think a promotion to and then relegation would be the road to ruin because anytime spent in the premier wouldn't inevitably risk our long term future.

Agreed. “He who dares, wins, Rodney!” Never a truer sentence said from a Peckham boy who’s dad once said that Millwall would win the Cup!

Let’s get to the Prem first!

So what next? dreams of hitting the big time or happy and content enough as you are?

Both, for the time being!

 

[VassalsWall]

Bloody hell LwtL - that hurt my head. Preferred it when you were in your Queen Victoria stage after JB's untimely death when you couldn't get excited about football.

 

[new cross wall]

expectations are high
its our 1st home of the season not the end of the world
was a hard game on Saturday very tight they just got the edge .... just because we may have improved don't mean all the other sides have stayed the same
we all know this season is going to be a lot harder with the teams that are now in the championship
if we fucked GR off now all the work in per-season is out the window give him a chance FFS

 

[Life with the Lions]

Bloody hell LwtL - that hurt my head. Preferred it when you were in your Queen Victoria stage after JB's untimely death when you couldn't get excited about football.

Blame Peckham!

If he hadn’t written his bloody long post, I wouldn’t have had to reply to him!*

I’d ask you what you thought of my post, but you probably fell asleep after the first paragraph, so I won’t bother!