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- Thread starter ‘ArryBoy
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Teams have sussed out how we play and how to put pressure on us.
Centre midfield a problem, albeit I think Casper looks promising. Danny and Bryan (who I also rate) squeezed for space on the flanks and Flemming docile which means our primary outlet to our strikers is hoof ball by under pressure 3 central defenders
I don’t normally clamor for a manager’s head but I really feel GR has lost the players. Unfortunately he won’t be sacked until Christmas at the earliest and, by then, we’ll be in a relegation battle.
Disillusionment with GR and the way we’re playing could be a contributory factor in Zian’s performance level dropping, although I still think he’s a lazy bugger and a bit of a poseur
I’m not overly confident about the coming months!
HappyLion
Well-known member
Annoyingly we have the players we need albeit that I have not seen our new keeper tested & his poor distribution needs sorting out.
Until GR gets the subs on earlier & stops trying to defend a draw I cant see things improving. I thought he had got past this negative routine last season.
On the keeper. In the warm up he overhit every ball. Either made the catchers back pedal or catch the ball over their heads. Call me old fashioned if you like but shouldnt they be arriving between feet and chest, or at least in front of them? And the last moan. In extra time and trying to get something he picks the ball up near the corner flag and ambles back into the box. Then faffs around placing the ball. No urgency at all. Very strange.
Until GR gets the subs on earlier & stops trying to defend a draw I cant see things improving. I thought he had got past this negative routine last season.
On the keeper. In the warm up he overhit every ball. Either made the catchers back pedal or catch the ball over their heads. Call me old fashioned if you like but shouldnt they be arriving between feet and chest, or at least in front of them? And the last moan. In extra time and trying to get something he picks the ball up near the corner flag and ambles back into the box. Then faffs around placing the ball. No urgency at all. Very strange.
Phlion54
Well-known member
Don't think we have Got any better goalkeeping wise but cost us 1.2 million,kicking is in the Bart mode - awful , and yes He is slow in everything he does , Flemming not interested it seems or overated , our passing by the majority of the team is schoolboy level and the match tactics / formation is too predictable , we have the players but not the ideas on how to attack & win games at home now
Start with 7 defenders at home and you are hoping for a 1-0 win. You can't point the finger at the front 4 as get they fuck all service.
Sad thing was when the goal went in, nobody was surprised or bothered in our block, it just emptied.
Can't knock GR's overall record but we desperately need a plan b at home
Sad thing was when the goal went in, nobody was surprised or bothered in our block, it just emptied.
Can't knock GR's overall record but we desperately need a plan b at home
Life with the Lions
Well-known member
Teams had already sussed us out by the last 10 games of last season, when our form had really started to drop off, and players like Flemming were targeted by the likes of Huddersfield to stifle their play and goal scoring opportunities, which culminated in the debacle of the Blackburn game, last day of the season!
The problem we face now is that Rowett doesn’t see that there’s a problem, otherwise it would have been spoken about and addressed in pre season!
But that’s partly because both Hutch and Cooper aren’t confident and don’t have the ball skills to play the ball out from defence and give it to the midfield. They panic and just want to get the ball away so hoof ball is their only option!Centre midfield a problem, albeit I think Casper looks promising. Danny and Bryan (who I also rate) squeezed for space on the flanks and Flemming docile which means our primary outlet to our strikers is hoof ball by under pressure 3 central defenders
Yet the players performed brilliantly for Rowett last week against Boro, so I don’t think it’s the case that the players don’t want to play for him, but rather he needs to somehow keep them motivated with belief that last weeks result wasn’t a one off, and that it’s a case of replicating the Boro performance week in, week out! Keep doing that, and we’ll win more games this season than draw or lose them!
It took Flemming a while last season to get going (and that was probably due to him having to acclimatise to the different pace of the Championship), but this Burnley transfer nonsense seems to have affected him, which is crazy when you think about it, because if you as a player know there’s interest in you (and then that interest suddenly cools), then what better way to reignite that interest than by playing out of your skin to prove to everyone (including your own supporters) that you weren’t a one season wonder? It really doesn’t make sense when you think about it!Disillusionment with GR and the way we’re playing could be a contributory factor in Zian’s performance level dropping, although I still think he’s a lazy bugger and a bit of a poseur
We’re two games in, and our next four games against Norwich, Stoke and Birmingham (who have all strengthened in the summer transfer window), and Leeds, a relegated Prem side, could be tough ones if Rowett doesn’t get right his formation and his tactics, as well as giving belief to his players that they can keep putting in performances like they did against Boro! I think we’ll have a better understanding of where we are and where we’re headed after those four games! No need to panic just yet!
If you look at the past managers McGhee for example had 5 defensive outfield players (a back 4 and Livermore in Defensive Centre Midfield), Mick McCarthy the same. The Doc went with 6 (a back 4 and Les & Terry in midfield).
Unfortunately Rowett seems frightened of the opposition so plays 7 defensive outfield players, so it’s unlikely we’ll score or be entertaining. I was bored senseless in 15 minutes yesterday so heaven knows what our American owners thought.
Start a game to win it and go 451 if we have to close it out at the end would be better all round I think.
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Romney Lion
Well-known member
Rowett is what is going wrong
There are several reasons why yesterday did not go well and we lost. One could be that we played the occasion and not the game, the formation was wrong and there were one or two important players who were just not on their A game. What is undeniable is that GR is a cautious man and he quickly slips into the mould of picking a team not to lose rather than a team to win. He almost admitted to that in his post match interview. He said as the game wore on he said he wasn’t sure whether the right thing to do was to hang on to what he had and think that getting a point was better than nothing at all. We all thought in block 29 that he should have made subs after 60 minutes or so rather than to wait until 80 minutes when the game is coming to a close and the subs do not have a magic wand which they cam wave and everything comes right. You don’t need to be a football manager to know that it takes a few minutes to get into a game and to expect that the subs are going to be up to speed in seconds is unrealistic.
For those like us watching it was clear that them scoring in the second half was just a matter of time. By contrast to GR they made three attacking subs after 60 minutes or so, peppered our goal with shots that went wide. Their goal at the death was no surprise. They put our defence under pressure for the majority of the second half and eventually we cracked.
GR played the same team as the one that beat Boro. Five at the back away makes some sense but at home it doesn’t add up. And it is only the second league game of the season. Like KJ used to say, let’s look at it after ten games and see where we are but on yesterdays showing things do not look promising.
For those like us watching it was clear that them scoring in the second half was just a matter of time. By contrast to GR they made three attacking subs after 60 minutes or so, peppered our goal with shots that went wide. Their goal at the death was no surprise. They put our defence under pressure for the majority of the second half and eventually we cracked.
GR played the same team as the one that beat Boro. Five at the back away makes some sense but at home it doesn’t add up. And it is only the second league game of the season. Like KJ used to say, let’s look at it after ten games and see where we are but on yesterdays showing things do not look promising.
BigPaul
Well-known member
There seems to be one significant fact regarding Bristol City that everyone seems to have overlooked.
That is that they did EXACTLY the same thing to us in last season's fixture and were absolutely delighted to go home with a point from a 0-0 draw.
OK, they didn't nick a goal at the end, but apart from that the display was identical.
We should have KNOWN how they would play and prepare a plan to fight it.
Should we say shame on GR for not anticipating their approach?
or
Is it that we simply don't have the players to break down a team that plays this way against us?
It is a high risk strategy because it requires so much energy to compete like that for 90 minutes. However, with 5 subs, some of the pain has been removed.
That is that they did EXACTLY the same thing to us in last season's fixture and were absolutely delighted to go home with a point from a 0-0 draw.
OK, they didn't nick a goal at the end, but apart from that the display was identical.
We should have KNOWN how they would play and prepare a plan to fight it.
Should we say shame on GR for not anticipating their approach?
or
Is it that we simply don't have the players to break down a team that plays this way against us?
It is a high risk strategy because it requires so much energy to compete like that for 90 minutes. However, with 5 subs, some of the pain has been removed.
new cross wall
Well-known member
How are you digging out the new keeper already FFs
cos his kicking in the warm up was shit LOL
you are the person who rates George long
new pair of glasses mate or just give it a rest
Life with the Lions
Well-known member
You’re asking a lot for our footballers with shit for brains to remember what way City set up against them last season, aren’t you?
Christ, they can’t even remember what Rowett told them to do, five minutes before they walk out onto the pitch at either half!
BigPaul
Well-known member
Maybe I'm expecting too much, but could they not have watched the video of that match as part of their preparation for Saturday's game?You’re asking a lot for our footballers with shit for brains to remember what way City set up against them last season, aren’t you?
Christ, they can’t even remember what Rowett told them to do, five minutes before they walk out onto the pitch at either half!
If I can remember it and I wasn't even there, surely they can??
Life with the Lions
Well-known member
I’d like to think that the team watch back the video of every match after they‘ve played it, but you wouldn’t think so sometimes when certain players keep making the same mistakes, week in, week out, and these mistakes aren’t picked up!
Kryan Bing
Well-known member
I agree...even our new players that weren't there should be familiar with that game. They should of picked the brains of the players that were there. Fuck me, it's not much to ask, is it? Christ, they take us all for right mugs.
What is frustrating and slightly baffling is that Rowett has acquired attack minded players and a new forward yet he still sets us up to be very rigid and defensive. Last season you could half understand it and defend him but he's gone abour remedying that but is making them play with the handbrake on and a cautious mindset/ approach.
I read on HOF that by all accounts the players are not comfortable with or happy with the formation or game plan. If that's the case i hope Rowett is open to listening to them and also willing to change things. He will get away with them being unhappy if we win but not when don't and don't even look like winning.
Somethings gotta change. It's his team now bar a few players so there's no excuses or reasons for performances like Saturday's. It's not on for any manager to send out a team at the Den that's not drilled and set up to win.
The strikers won't score many if we spend 90 minutes trying to nullify our opponant. The midield that started Saturday isn't going to cause teams many problems. Unless Flemming fancies it i can't see where the assists for goal are coming from.
Yes two wing backs that can bomb forward. Problem i see with there is Danny's crossing needs to be much better otherwise the position is pointless and it's a lot of bombing about and wasted energy for Nothing. He had a great chance not long before they scored. If that chance fallls to a striker i'm confident he's scoring. Fine margins,
Tired players make mistakes, defenders mistakes cost goals. The one Saturday was a terrible sight. If Cooper didn't have the two wall players in front of him causing confusion i believe he would cleared that cross. Wallace has to connect with that ball if he's called for it and gone for it.
Rowett is capable of getting it right tactically if he isn't the stubborn type. He must see that the players aren't comfortable on the pitch. He need's to trust the players a bit more and allow them get forward and play on the front foot. We have a few players with pace now, they should be free to skin their markers and do what they're best at.
He didn't believe we could win in the second half so his focus and mindset was on not losing. He very nearly got away with it. Two shots on target and one solitary corner is all we mustered. Bristols one and only shot on target in the last seconds of injury time got them the win.
Food for thought for Rowett. It might helps us long term, he made a bad call ,has egg on his face and burnt fingers. He can't do that again. He has to change things up. Norwich away next is the last fixture we needed. Should be seen as a free hit and not one to bash a manager up on given our abysmal record at that place. Saying that we do need and deserve to see a much bigger and better effort from both Rowett and the players.
I read on HOF that by all accounts the players are not comfortable with or happy with the formation or game plan. If that's the case i hope Rowett is open to listening to them and also willing to change things. He will get away with them being unhappy if we win but not when don't and don't even look like winning.
Somethings gotta change. It's his team now bar a few players so there's no excuses or reasons for performances like Saturday's. It's not on for any manager to send out a team at the Den that's not drilled and set up to win.
He's brought some decent players in. Rowett needs to quickly work out what to do with them and play them to there strengths. We're stronger up front and not reilant on Bradshaw. I was expecting to see an attack focused team on Saturday cause we have players that will create and score.
The strikers won't score many if we spend 90 minutes trying to nullify our opponant. The midield that started Saturday isn't going to cause teams many problems. Unless Flemming fancies it i can't see where the assists for goal are coming from.
Yes two wing backs that can bomb forward. Problem i see with there is Danny's crossing needs to be much better otherwise the position is pointless and it's a lot of bombing about and wasted energy for Nothing. He had a great chance not long before they scored. If that chance fallls to a striker i'm confident he's scoring. Fine margins,
Tired players make mistakes, defenders mistakes cost goals. The one Saturday was a terrible sight. If Cooper didn't have the two wall players in front of him causing confusion i believe he would cleared that cross. Wallace has to connect with that ball if he's called for it and gone for it.
Rowett is capable of getting it right tactically if he isn't the stubborn type. He must see that the players aren't comfortable on the pitch. He need's to trust the players a bit more and allow them get forward and play on the front foot. We have a few players with pace now, they should be free to skin their markers and do what they're best at.
He didn't believe we could win in the second half so his focus and mindset was on not losing. He very nearly got away with it. Two shots on target and one solitary corner is all we mustered. Bristols one and only shot on target in the last seconds of injury time got them the win.
Food for thought for Rowett. It might helps us long term, he made a bad call ,has egg on his face and burnt fingers. He can't do that again. He has to change things up. Norwich away next is the last fixture we needed. Should be seen as a free hit and not one to bash a manager up on given our abysmal record at that place. Saying that we do need and deserve to see a much bigger and better effort from both Rowett and the players.
I think they can and do remember. That' the problems
coldblower
Well-known member
He has to have more bollocks going for 3 points at home.
Life with the Lions
Well-known member
Agreed!
Peckham, this stuff about the players not being comfortable with or happy with the formation or game plan, does this come from a reliable source from someone inside the club, telling that person on HOF, or is it just an unfounded rumour?
If it’s true, I wonder how many of the players feel this way, and exactly who they are? Has one or more of them confronted Rowett to his face about the fact that his formation or game plan isn’t working, or are some muttering quietly about it, but don’t say anything for fear of losing their place in the team?
Some of it is down to the players as well, though! You would have thought, after the Reading Cup game, collective professional pride would have kicked in, and senior players, the likes of Hutch and Cooper, would have got the team together on the following days training session and said something like, “Right! Last night‘s performance was shit and totally unacceptable, and the supporters didn’t deserve to see that! We need to make amends this Saturday and give them something positive to shout about!” Obviously that little pep talk didn’t happen, or if it did, the conversation went through many ears and straight out the other side!
This. 100%. If the players can’t motivate themselves when there are anywhere between 15,000 - 18 000 supporters roaring them on, when will they?
Agreed. What I don’t understand is, if you find the right playing formula (as we did away to Boro), how hard is it to start the next game against City playing the same way? Start on the front foot, pass the ball about, press the opposition and let them worry about you - not the other way around!
I think the occasion last Saturday got to the players! They probably went out, worried that they didn’t want to lose in front of their supporters and new chairman, but by taking that approach, it became a self fulfilling prophecy that it could happen, and it did! I’ve said it before, our players mentality sometimes lets us down in certain key games, and I don‘t know if it’s solely down to the players, or whether a part of it is down to the coaching staff (Rowett and Barrett), who can’t or won’t gee the players up for certain crunch games!
Danny is never a wing back! Not in a million years! He’s fantastic defending, and going forward he’s fine, but his crossing can be awful at times! Bryan is a lot better, and can ping a decent cross in, but really, if we were playing 4-4-2, we’d have proper wingers doing that job so much better, and we need wingers who can skin defenders and get to the by line and whip decent crosses into the box! Other teams have players who can do this, so why can’t we?
Like you’ve said above, fine margins!
Yep, can’t argue with that!
No manager, regardless of what team they manage, and in what league, should never have that mindset! And it’s strange, because many games last season we played so much better in the 2nd half, and supporters were thinking, “Well, Rowett’s put a rocket up their arses during the HT team talk! Whatever he said to them, it’s working!” Usually we’d end up winning 2nd half games or at the very least come back to draw some! So why at HT on Saturday couldn’t Rowett muster up a “cry havoc and let slip the dogs of war” speech, knowing how much a packed Den wanted a victory for JB and his visiting family, one of which was our new chairman? Totally perplexing!
I think there will only be a Rowett bashing if he can’t motivate the team again, and the tactics and formation he uses brings about another poor performance like it was against City. The one thing we have to cling to is the fact that we normally up our game against the so called big boys (and Norwich are definitely a step up from City), and that the players need to know that their travelling supporters will back them, if they see heart, energy and desire!
We need to see all of that on Saturday, or it’s not going to be a good afternoon, methinks!